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Author Topic: The Gauntlet has been thrown down to DHBC  (Read 20182 times)
Artson
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« on: August 18, 2012, 12:26:51 PM »

I have received an email from an anonymous LACC rider, which I read in an honest competitive nature.  To sub phrase a lengthy email it states (now in point form via me) 

To DHBC
•   We understand by sheer numbers your club has deservedly wrapped up the 2012 Hillbrick Club Challenge. DHBC are almost double our clubs points.
•   We would like to offer a challenge to DHBC which we completely understand that you most likely will not accept.
•   We Challenge DHBC to an Italian pursuit with 11 riders to determine the 2012 club champions

Straight off the bat I have refused this suggestion as 100% uncool. However I would like to offer an amended proposal to DHBC.
•   In week 9 as the last event of the night, DHBC challenge LACC in an eleven person Italian pursuit
•   Each team must contain 2 x Juniors 2 x Women 2 x masters and the remaining 5 can be of any denomination
•   If LACC win DHBC will be reduced in points to equal LACC accumulative score at the conclusion of week nine
•   If DHBC win statuesque will be kept and DHBC will continue on to win the 2012 Hillbrick challenge

So why on earth would DHBC consider this challenge?

1.   First off it is a challenge, so can they resist the temptation to destroy the opposition?
2.   With still three weeks remaining it would not mean that DHBC would lose the series (should they lose the Italian)
3.   It would revitalise the Hillbrick point score making it a more watched serries

The ball is now in DHBC’s Court. They have no solid reasons to accept this challenge, but will they?
 
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Andyh
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« Reply #1 on: August 19, 2012, 02:37:26 AM »

Interesting one that's for sure, how about for the future just taking the top ten scorers from each club each night to level the playing field abit. Hats off to DHBC for massive attendance and good racing just the same..,
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nigelapps@bigpond.com
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« Reply #2 on: August 19, 2012, 05:10:12 AM »

Sounds like a good compromise from Crafty, if DHBC want to take up the challenge that is. The challenge from the LACC camp is going to be coming up with the quota - we are heavily laden with old blokes, so the masters bit will be no problem, we just have to get a few ring ins - Women and Juniors.
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Nitro Nige
nigelapps@bigpond.com
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« Reply #3 on: August 19, 2012, 06:00:00 AM »

Further to my last post...

Good job Dulwich Hill, we at LACC have many more members who don't bother. Good to see you guys & girls mixing it with the best, even if the best are wearing black...
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Nitro Nige
troublemaker
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« Reply #4 on: August 19, 2012, 11:58:29 AM »

 Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy,,,,,This could turn into an "Underbelly Series".....
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lizanne
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« Reply #5 on: August 19, 2012, 11:19:46 PM »

as if! no ring ins
i'm sure you guys have 2 women and 2 juniors. 

DHBC will smash LACC easy!

in true RAW fashion BRING IT!
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steliop
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« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2012, 03:38:44 AM »

We'll have no trouble finding masters. -Perhaps 2 juniors, 2 women, and 7 masters would be fairer?

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scott
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« Reply #7 on: August 21, 2012, 10:27:33 PM »

you could always not dish out points for just turning up. that would even things out amongst the clubs significantly, especially those that do not have a "home track".
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bigfriendlyvegan
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« Reply #8 on: August 22, 2012, 01:07:56 AM »

Our problem isn't a lack of juniors and women, it's a lack of juniors and women at RAW.

Typical LACC household:


Typical DHBC household:



I suggest a 3 person team sprint. The grade values of the riders must equal or exceed 11. That is, 2 x div 4 + 1 x div 3 (4+4+3=11), 1 x div 1 + 2 x div 5 (1+5+5=11) and so on. It's like a mini-Italian. Quick, easy and possible for both camps.
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bigfriendlyvegan
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« Reply #9 on: August 22, 2012, 01:13:00 AM »

as if! no ring ins
i'm sure you guys have 2 women and 2 juniors. 


Would you accept Stel in a dress?
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steliop
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« Reply #10 on: August 22, 2012, 10:34:50 AM »

Sorry dude, all my dresses are sleeveless. -UCI rules require sleeves.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2012, 11:06:21 AM by steliop » Logged
Eleri
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« Reply #11 on: August 22, 2012, 12:07:16 PM »

Thanks for the offer to race us LACC!

We've made RAW an important part of DHBC racing and we do get good numbers - I think 23 club members have raced at RAW in 2012. We have club members placing in races in all divisions and genuine participation at all levels. And a bunch of strong juniors coming up through the divisions.

If all we were trying to do was win by stacking the numbers, then I don't think we would see that.   In fact, we are trying to get more people racing on the track, not trying to win the Club Challenge.  It's just a happy outcome. 

I'd suggest that if other clubs want to challenge us in future years, with numbers, it would be a really good thing and I welcome it.
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bigfriendlyvegan
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« Reply #12 on: August 22, 2012, 12:51:35 PM »

Eleri et al. @ DHBC,

First up, it wasn't me who wrote Crafty an email, but I did express similar sentiments in conversation with him.

Yes, you'll win the club championship no matter what. We don't begrudge you that at all, you guys do a wonderful job and you field a big strong team. The problem is that it's simply not a competition anymore and so the "challenge" is moot.

Aside from the Hillbrick challenge, I would like to see some more club based competition at RAW. Something that would get the coasties in in numbers for a week or two, something that will get Manly excited and double their numbers occasionally. Something that would inspire the current riders to drag along a friend or two to try things out "because we really need you, come on, don't be slack".

Having a little bit of inter-club rivalry in a fun environment like RAW also spices things up a little bit. Maybe it will bring a bit of WWF type excitement to the 'drome. Maybe Crafty can come up with a recurring club based format to keep the points a little bit more closely distributed and give the smaller clubs (i.e. those without their own velodromes) a go.

So, if you're up for the challenge, forget the points. Maybe we can have a bit of a pride challenge. Losing club has to wear the winning club's jersey for a lap of shame, or they have to buy a round of Bernhard beers, or something.
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lizanne
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« Reply #13 on: August 22, 2012, 11:16:05 PM »

Hey Stelio I have a cute little dress with sleeves you can borrow. if you want to wear it i'll accept you as a LACC chick. 

I totally agree that we need special team challenges (maybe with bonus points) on select weeks, to encourage smaller teams to grow numbers. 

I know it's getting close, and a few DHBC riders are going to be at coota, but i recon we can still pull together an awesome team on friday and smash LACC. 

Lets race for team pride and beers after!
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steliop
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« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2012, 04:16:38 AM »

Oh yeah, I'm sure one of Lizanne's dresses would fit me!

Scott, when I first started at RAW I was frustrated at the amount of points awarded for just showing up. Over time I've realised that it’s the best thing for growing RAW and club track cycling in general.

The logic is you don't need to have the best to have a chance at winning the championship, you just need numbers. Building numbers is good for your club and good for RAW/track cycling in general. Once you have numbers, a percentage of those make their way to the top to become great cyclists. DHBC are a good example. Lots of riders means lots of points, means more of a chance to have great riders in the higher grades.

While we're on the subject of points and fairness, I wonder if Crafty has ever considered an Italian at the end of the season. That is, run the club point score as normal to determine the minor premiers, but then have Italian finals for the top eight clubs, or whatever number works. Chances are it will still end with the minor premiers as winners, but it will keep us interested right up to the grand final.

Looking at the point score so far, it’s obvious who will win. By the way, you deserve it DHBC, hats off to you.

Looking at the top 14 below, I see maybe 3 clubs thinking about how they can build numbers to catch DHBC, if not for this year maybe in the next year or two. I also see 10 other clubs who might be thinking they shouldn’t bother because they might be out of reach.

If I use the current point score as an example, and there were Italian finals for the top eight clubs, I foresee 8 clubs really competing to stay up there and another 6 clubs within 200 points of the top eight, trying to recruit numbers to build their points score.

1   Dulwich Hill   2330
2   Lidcombe   1449
3   Penrith   1316
4   St George    1296
5   Hunter Districts    951
6   Central Coast   861
7   Sutherland   753
8   Illawarra   679
9   ATTA nsw   600
10   Bankstown Sports    563
11   Parramatta   557
12   Bicisport    533
13   Canberra   526
14   Syd Uni Velo   484

The benefits would be:
-more clubs pushing to build numbers.
-more clubs in with a chance beyond week 3.
-more riders means more budget to award first, second and third place to clubs in the finals.
-more female and junior riders to meet minimum numbers for the Italian Grand Final.

Any chance of something along those lines for next year Crafty?
« Last Edit: August 23, 2012, 08:29:12 AM by steliop » Logged
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